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Reader comment on:
New York Drops Off the List Of ‘Big Five' Orchestras
in response to reader comment: In defense of Maestro Lorin Maazel

Submitted by Mark B, Dec 6, 2006 17:04

Music is art, and art should be experienced and enjoyed and discussed in a civilized manner. I can be mesmerized listening to a student orchestra playing their collective heart out in Mahler, but forgive me when I long for Cleveland, Chicago or Philadelphia when the San Francisco Symphony's sound cannot fill up Carnegie Hall or there are several cracks in the horn after the adagietto in the Mahler #5. Despite being able to secure Martin Chailfour as its concertmaster--formerly the assistant concertmaster in Cleveland--L.A. still has an undistinctive string sound, often a rough edge and an overwhelming brassy sound that might otherwise work in Chicago or Philadelphia. Cincinnati and Minnesota are currently experiencing heydays no doubt, but they do not have the same worldwide demand as the Big 5. Despite Franz Welser-Most, Cleveland says that it is more demand than ever and does not have enough tour dates for all of the offers. Cleveland has multi year residencies in Vienna, Lucerne and now Miami. On and off again in terms of being a commanding conductor, Welser-Most has had many successes and the Cleveland sounds fabulous still. Clearly, Cleveland selected wisely over Eschenbach, as Welser-Most was apparently courted by Philadelphia as well. However, Philadelphia will recover from its current problems when Eschenbach leaves and will be as great as ever again. (Keep an eye on Ivan Fischer, who is currently making his subscription concert debut in Philadelphia. Perhaps not a fireball, Fischer is one of the most experienced and thoughtful conductors in Europe right now.) I have never put the Boston Symphony at the top of my list, but they did manage to secure Levine and achieve moments of greatness during the Ozawa years when Pittsburgh was struggling along with Previn. The New York Phil recovered from the Mehta years, and has returned to serious form under Masur and Maazel. Lorin Maazel is like Barbra Streisand, you take the bad parts with the greatness. And, as for the Chicago Symphony, they were driven to excess towards the end of the Solti era and Barenboim's conducting was often inconsistent until the end of his tenure. It is perhaps the least flexible in terms of sound of the Big 5 (Cleveland is probably the most flexible), and the brass still remains uncontrollable at times. However, this is not the case when they play for the likes of Boulez and Haitink, who is the new principal conductor. There are reasons why Chicago seems to consistently secure the best conductors and guest artists, and will soon appear in Carnegie Hall with Boulez. It is not always to my taste, but it is still a great orchestra.

The Big 5 all have strong lengenday histories that have served them well into the future.

Note: Comments are screened, and in some cases edited, before posting. We reserve the right to reject anything we find objectionable.

Other reader comments on this article

Comment By Date

This is a highly personal, but realistic, take on the most current status of orchestral music. I can attest to... [MORE]

Tom

Mar 20, 2008 23:45

Finally, a review where someone is willing to take the risk of telling it like it is. Perhaps if the... [MORE]

Don Skochinski

Mar 16, 2007 15:20

Although the big five is an outdated concept, these orchestras still hold more prestige over any of the orchestras mentioned,... [MORE]

david

Jan 31, 2007 05:32

LA Phil: Last year I had the unique pleasure of hearing the San Francisco Symphony and the Los Angeles Philharmonic... [MORE]

ben dominitz

Jan 2, 2007 20:19

finally someone said what had to be said - thank you - please write more honest articles like this [MORE]

a

Dec 25, 2006 21:59

Do you realize you've just criticized some of the greatest musicians in the world? The New York Philharmonic comments in... [MORE]

CK

Dec 13, 2006 23:08

This is big to hear that Pittsburgh is in the Top 5. As a Pittsburgh Symphony fan and concert "goer"... [MORE]

Neil L. King

Dec 11, 2006 09:43

Subjective appraisals are really of value only to the ones making them. Do you hear, see, feel or imagine what... [MORE]

Forrest

Dec 10, 2006 15:08

I'm not sure how any of your so-called top five orchestras would fare if they had world orchestra parading past... [MORE]

George

Dec 9, 2006 11:20

Obviously this writer has both hearing and visual problems. I have been in this profession for 65 years and know... [MORE]

Pierre Medard

Dec 9, 2006 11:12

Re: Eschenbach hiring Have we gotten to the point where "unilaterally and without consultation" means "had musician representation on the search... [MORE]

RAD

Dec 8, 2006 14:56

What a silly exercise. There are so many really fine orchestras in this country why should anyone want to rate... [MORE]

D. Th. J.

Dec 7, 2006 19:23

It's funny to me to see how passionate some people are about something that matters so little. From Bruce, who... [MORE]

Brian

Dec 7, 2006 16:02

According to whom? I make my own aesthetic judgments in these matters. Always! [MORE]

Patricia

Dec 7, 2006 10:11

I have to say I actually feel bad for you. If your ears are this bad that you think LA... [MORE]

An maestro that will remain nameless

Dec 6, 2006 18:18

As punishment for expressing sweeping opinions based on biased motives, Mr. Kirshnit ought to be sent to each city of... [MORE]

Steven Honigberg

Dec 6, 2006 17:37

Other than making the well-known point that there are many great orchestras in the US outside of New York, Boston,... [MORE]

Marko Velikonja

Dec 6, 2006 14:20

For sheer versatility, the Boston Symphony under James Levine is arguably the finest orchestra in America. Its winds and brass... [MORE]

marc

Jan 25, 2008 12:51

I think Mr. Kirshnit nailed it with the inclusion of Pittsburgh and Cincinnati. The only quibble I have is replacing... [MORE]

pa

Dec 6, 2006 14:05

It has long been an "open secret" that there were several orchestras out there that could play at the same... [MORE]

Bruce B.

Dec 6, 2006 12:56

The concept of the Big Five among Among Orchestras has long made sense. The Boston Symphony, Chicago Symphony, and Philadelphia... [MORE]

John L. Turner, MD

Dec 6, 2006 09:38

Any orchestra alive today is worth listening too. The environment is far from friendly to classical music and only the... [MORE]

Marvin E. Gozum, MD

Dec 8, 2006 07:48

I regret that Mr. Kirshnit's observations on the New York Philharmonic are amazingly short-sighted. Can he actually forget that when... [MORE]

Lloyd Paguia Arriola

Dec 6, 2006 04:42

I don't understand the purpose of this article. Doe Mr. Kirshnit think he's cutting edge by writing this? Look, we've... [MORE]

Ken

Dec 5, 2006 21:13

One more example of Fred Kirshnit's bellyaching about how good things "used to be." It makes one wonder - if... [MORE]

sh

Dec 5, 2006 11:04

I agree completely. This gentleman is a windbag with nothing insightful to say. What arrogance to think he has the... [MORE]

Laura Waterland

Dec 6, 2006 08:00

The Sun should have emblazoned "Opinion" over this article. Certainly the writer stands outside of the consensus of received opinion.... [MORE]

Mark Stenroos

Dec 6, 2006 13:56

Music is art, and art should be experienced and enjoyed and discussed in a civilized manner. I can be...

Mark B

Dec 6, 2006 17:04

"One wonders why the NYPO is obsessed with conductors whose surnames begin with "M," but at least they got it... [MORE]

Michael

Dec 6, 2006 18:46

"One wonders why the NYPO is obsessed with conductors whose surnames begin with "M," but at least they got it... [MORE]

Michael

Dec 6, 2006 18:48

Of course this article is an opinion--that much should be obvious. I agree with the bulk of your defense or... [MORE]

Erich

Dec 7, 2006 22:38

Dear Erich - Well, you seem to ignore the qualifier to my statement that the top orchestras had little room to... [MORE]

Mark Stenroos

Dec 13, 2006 16:58

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